Any pure EV owners here?

R181

Grumpy old man
New EU law requires EV fast chargers along main roads by 2025 (electrek.co)

Really important law has come into force for EU which significantly strengthens infrastructure ambition in EU.
Fast charging stations every 60km (at least 150kW) - for Cars and Vans from 2025
Hydrogen refuelling stations every 200km serving Cars and Trucks too from 2030
Drivers must be able to pay easily (w/o need for subscription)
A very good move.

I guess the light finally came on in that you can't mandate something if there is too little infrastructure to support it. Better late than never. That should have been part of the mandate to switch to EVs in the first place.

I wish they had similar legislation on the books in Canada. I doubt that you'd ever see a fast-charging station every 60km here on the Trans-Canada Highway as you won't find a gas station every 60km through our area as it is now.

Bob
 

p.b

Forum GOD!
Yea, it is a bit misleading as it will not stop the transition to EVs but it does show that there is a reluctance by a good part of the public to make that transition just yet. I think that indicates that there is a lack of enough infrastructure to support EVs in quite a few areas.

Bob
Righto.
I think it's also a bit of a chicken and egg issue - people are going to be reluctant to buy EVs because of lacking infrastructure in some places, but without people buying EVs there's going to be less pressure to make companies/countries build more infrastructure.
Not everyone is having trouble selling EVs...
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Tesla Production And Deliveries Graphed Through Q1 2023: More Records (insideevs.com)

Tesla now has the scale to massively reduce margins and still make a profit, you can only achieve this while selling several 100k vehicles per quarter rather than a few 10k, and by making it affordable they can sell more - a trick learnt from Henry Ford, ironically. Tesla only started making profits when the Y turned up and provided that volume but that doesn't change the fact that Tesla can sell EVs while everyone else appears to struggle. Maybe it is just down to there being so many more Tesla chargers available.
 

R181

Grumpy old man
Not everyone is having trouble selling EVs...
View attachment 137467

View attachment 137466
Tesla Production And Deliveries Graphed Through Q1 2023: More Records (insideevs.com)

Tesla now has the scale to massively reduce margins and still make a profit, you can only achieve this while selling several 100k vehicles per quarter rather than a few 10k, and by making it affordable they can sell more - a trick learnt from Henry Ford, ironically. Tesla only started making profits when the Y turned up and provided that volume but that doesn't change the fact that Tesla can sell EVs while everyone else appears to struggle. Maybe it is just down to there being so many more Tesla chargers available.
I would hope that Tesla has no problem selling EVs as that is the only type of vehicle they sell and have a vested interest in trying to ensure there are enough chargers to support their users. The other car makers don't have quite the incentive that Tesla has as they make ICE, Hybrid and EVs. That may be part of the problem which that new EU law that you linked to should go a long way to incentivising other makers, the petroleum industry and other companies to get more active in increasing the infrastructure of charging stations. That is especially important in areas with a low population density and long distances between major cities.

Personally, an EV would be fine for me as a city and local area car. Not so much when I travel to the next larger city west of us that is roughly 400 miles away. Going east of us, it is about the same distance to a city that is similar in size. Normally, both are about 8 hr trips with a stop midway for fuel with about half a tank gone. When I can do that with an EV and have used only half the range in the battery, I'll be a happy camper. It really all depends on where you live and what you want to use an EV for with current models. EVs should be there in a few years' time no doubt.

Bob
 

R181

Grumpy old man
I found this interesting as it is more related to the conditions on this side of the pound. Keep in mind that his trips were in a densely populated area and there are many areas where the population is sparse and so are the services.


Bob
 

Chris

Forum DOG!
Staff member
I'm not opposed to an EV, but the cost of buying one, the cost of having a charging point put in at home and the lack of available charging points when out and about put me off. For most of my journeys the range of an EV would be more than adequate, and I dislike filling my car so the idea of it charging overnight while I sleep and being full in the morning is appealing. "Most of my journeys" is not the same as "all of my journeys" however, so visiting family members who live 150 miles away and don't have off-road parking would be difficult. We also tend to holiday in the UK by renting a cottage, and none that we've ever stayed at have had provision for charging an EV.
 

UKRob

Forum GOD!
I'm not opposed to an EV, but the cost of buying one, the cost of having a charging point put in at home and the lack of available charging points when out and about put me off. For most of my journeys the range of an EV would be more than adequate, and I dislike filling my car so the idea of it charging overnight while I sleep and being full in the morning is appealing. "Most of my journeys" is not the same as "all of my journeys" however, so visiting family members who live 150 miles away and don't have off-road parking would be difficult. We also tend to holiday in the UK by renting a cottage, and none that we've ever stayed at have had provision for charging an EV.
You have to develop a different mindset in terms of charging. We have used EVs on holidays in Cornwall - including St Ives - a journey of over 260 miles from our home in the Midlands. A trip round to Carbis Bay was also used as an opportunity to charge the car which was all we needed to get back home without a further stop. The point I’m making is that you don’t need charging facilities at your holiday home - there are actually quite a lot of charging points available it’s just that you won’t be aware of them if you don’t need them.
 

R181

Grumpy old man
You have to develop a different mindset in terms of charging. We have used EVs on holidays in Cornwall - including St Ives - a journey of over 260 miles from our home in the Midlands. A trip round to Carbis Bay was also used as an opportunity to charge the car which was all we needed to get back home without a further stop. The point I’m making is that you don’t need charging facilities at your holiday home - there are actually quite a lot of charging points available it’s just that you won’t be aware of them if you don’t need them.
That might be the case in Europe but again that is not the case in a great many areas in North America. Also travelling in the cold months will really reduce your range between having to keep the battery warm and warm the car interior. In my part of North America, you try to travel 400 miles a day to get anywhere with one stop to refuel/recharge. It is doable in the warm months but in the colder ones not so much. The more densely populated areas of North America are more like Europe. The charging points here have to become as easy to find as gas stations currently are.

Bob
 

Chris

Forum DOG!
Staff member
You have to develop a different mindset in terms of charging. We have used EVs on holidays in Cornwall - including St Ives - a journey of over 260 miles from our home in the Midlands. A trip round to Carbis Bay was also used as an opportunity to charge the car which was all we needed to get back home without a further stop. The point I’m making is that you don’t need charging facilities at your holiday home - there are actually quite a lot of charging points available it’s just that you won’t be aware of them if you don’t need them.
Do the charging points tend to be at places like supermarkets where you can kill some time while you wait for it to charge? I imagine it would involve a bit more planning, one advantage of ICE is that filling the tank only takes a few minutes, but if you can charge the car while you do something else it wouldn't be much of an inconvenience. Heating affecting range was something I'd not really considered as I'm used to a diesel where the heat's produced anyway, but of course with an EV you're going to have to actually use battery power to run a heater. Most of my trips I doubt it'd be an actual problem though. What kind of range are you getting in real-world usage?
 
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Chris

Forum DOG!
Staff member
The loss of range in an EV really depends on how cold your days and nights get. I'd guess that if you live in a fairly mild climate that it is not much of a concern. It is a concern where I live as we have many days and nights with temperatures below +20F/-7C right on down to and past -30C.


Bob
The coldest I remember it getting in the UK is -15C and that was unusual, last year the coldest it got was about -6C. The other thing is that the UK is a LOT smaller than the US / Canada, so here we're dealing with shorter journeys and a milder climate.
 

UKRob

Forum GOD!
Do the charging points tend to be at places like supermarkets where you can kill some time while you wait for it to charge? I imagine it would involve a bit more planning, one advantage of ICE is that filling the tank only takes a few minutes, but if you can charge the car while you do something else it wouldn't be much of an inconvenience. Heating affecting range wasn't something I'd not really considered as I'm used to a diesel where the heat's produced anyway, but of course with an EV you're going to have to actually use battery power to run a heater. Most of my trips I doubt it'd be an actual problem though. What kind of range are you getting in real-world usage?
We have tended to use the superchargers on motorways as you can take a toilet break, get a coffee and stretch you legs in the 30 to 40 minutes needed for a full recharge. At holiday resorts you may find hotels have chargers installed so you can always use their bar facilities but increasingly there are chargers in locations that have space - I’ve just come back from my local builders merchant and noticed they have about 6 parking spaces dedicated to EV charging.

As regards range - my wife’s Tesla is the longer range advertised at nearly 360 and she gets about 310 driving on motorways. I’m a more passive driver so would get probably 340 maybe more.
 

R181

Grumpy old man
The coldest I remember it getting in the UK is -15C and that was unusual, last year the coldest it got was about -6C. The other thing is that the UK is a LOT smaller than the US / Canada, so here we're dealing with shorter journeys and a milder climate.
Exactly, and that is the reason I am not in on EVs just yet. They are getting better all the time and my next vehicle will likely be an EV. I am sure in most of Europe the EVs are just fine now.

OT but still concerning cold weather but this time concerning diesels. I had a 1985 Ford V8 diesel 3/4-ton truck, and that thing could be very difficult to start in very cold weather. It had 2 huge batteries and was difficult to turn over fast enough to start on the very cold days unless the dual block heaters were plugged in. Once started, unless you had a grill cover it would not hold engine temperature if you left it idling. Needless to say, I never bought another diesel. I do take how a vehicle works in cold weather seriously.

Bob
 
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