Economists - the new enemy?

[les24preludes]

It may be the case that the only thing that can change the "economic recovery" into a proper plan to deal with climate change is to hit the economy hardest where it actually hurts. I can see rising sea levels doing this, though by the time this happens the further rise in sea levels will probably be irreversible due to positive feedback effects. The USA isn't listening now, but when Florida, New Orleans, parts of the California coast and eventually New York start going underwater, the economic damage will be impossible to ignore. By this time Holland, sadly, will be in big trouble, and the EU will have to react to this. At this point atmospheric temperatures will have risen to dangerous levels and presumably there will be a lot of migration of peoples. Poorer peoples, because the richer nations have largely temperate climates.

Anyway, here's a good interactive map of sea level rises.

https://coastal.climatecentral.org/...best_available&water_level=10.0&water_unit=ft

 

[les24preludes]

Food production in the new normal - governments need to revise their agriculture policies

Food systems contribute 21% to 37% of global greenhouse gases, and are significant contributors to deforestation, biodiversity loss and declining water tables. The Amazon forest fires in Brazil are directly related one way or another to food production.

Perhaps the biggest problem: livestock. They use a third of global cropland and contribute 15% of global greenhouse gas emissions. Heavy red meat eaters include the USA and South America. A recent New Yorker article noted that “every 4lbs of beef you eat contributes to as much global warming as flying from New York to London – and the average American eats that much each month.” Red meat is generally considered the most resource-intensive food on the planet.

For the world to make a shift to a vegetarian based diet, common in Africa and parts of Asia, we need governments and the food industry to make it easier. We need investment in public health information and the implementation of policies that promote healthy eating that is affordable, safe, convenient but still tasty.

What we eat matters. Not only for ourselves and the planet, but for the youth who have been out marching on the streets in the name of their future and right to live on this planet.

Jess Fanzo: Director of the Global Food Ethics and Policy Program at Johns Hopkins University

 

[Rufusdog]

Here’s a startling statistic: the average Canadian household spends CAN$1,766 (about £1,000) on food that is wasted every year. Another: in Canada organic waste in landfill produces methane gas that is 25X more damaging to the environment than carbon dioxide. Further: over 50% of food produced in Canada is lost or wasted every year; a third of this could be rescued.

(source: a 2019 study by Second Harvest and Value Change Management International)

 

[MntnMan62]

Here’s a startling statistic: the average Canadian household spends CAN$1,766 (about £1,000) on food that is wasted every year. Another: in Canada organic waste in landfill produces methane gas that is 25X more damaging to the environment than carbon dioxide. Further: over 50% of food produced in Canada is lost or wasted every year; a third of this could be rescued.

(source: a 2019 study by Second Harvest and Value Change Management International)

I would bet that those numbers in the US are even higher. Lots of waste here.

 

[R181]

Here’s a startling statistic: the average Canadian household spends CAN$1,766 (about £1,000) on food that is wasted every year. Another: in Canada organic waste in landfill produces methane gas that is 25X more damaging to the environment than carbon dioxide. Further: over 50% of food produced in Canada is lost or wasted every year; a third of this could be rescued.

(source: a 2019 study by Second Harvest and Value Change Management International)

I'd bet those numbers are down this year due to the big increase in families using food banks/soup kitchens. Tongue firmly in cheek.

Bob

 

[Vacumatic]

Methane in landfill. A number of local authorty landfills have pipework installed to provide a duct for methane gas which is then flared. I understand that when the valves are open that the flames can be spectacular.

Food waste. I am from the generation whose parents went through WW2 and endured food shortages, the idea that good food was thrown away postwar was just unacceptable and recipes were adapted to make use of food that had not been eaten on the previous day. That way of thinking is probably coming to an end with each successive generation and the awareness of Use By dates on food.

As an aside, why is it that bottled water has a use by date when, for one thing, it has been around for a million years and secondly may have recently been extracted from a stream passing through a farmers field where it has been presampled by any number of cows and sheep.

 

[MntnMan62]

Methane in landfill. A number of local authorty landfills have pipework installed to provide a duct for methane gas which is then flared. I understand that when the valves are open that the flames can be spectacular.

Food waste. I am from the generation whose parents went through WW2 and endured food shortages, the idea that good food was thrown away postwar was just unacceptable and recipes were adapted to make use of food that had not been eaten on the previous day. That way of thinking is probably coming to an end with each successive generation and the awareness of Use By dates on food.

As an aside, why is it that bottled water has a use by date when, for one thing, it has been around for a million years and secondly may have recently been extracted from a stream passing through a farmers field where it has been presampled by any number of cows and sheep.

I think a lot of bottled water comes from subterranean sources rather than surface sources.

 

[HereticHermit]

Methane in landfill. A number of local authorty landfills have pipework installed to provide a duct for methane gas which is then flared. I understand that when the valves are open that the flames can be spectacular.

Some down and out rag pickers in 3rd world landfills install homemade pipe network to cook food. Instead of flaring methane it could be useful after other poisonous gases are separated. Some of British landfill managing Cos are producing electricity for day to day operations by running methane operated turbines.

 

[R181]

Always wondered why bottled is such a hit in North America with consumers. Most all municipal sources of water are tested and treated to meet certain safe for human consumption standards. Those on wells have to submit water samples for testing on a regular basis also. Quite a few municipal water treatment plants are now outsourced to large companies who also control the major share of bottled water produced in North America. Can you say Coke, Pepsi and Nestle? That is to say nothing of the massive amounts bottled water contributes to plastic pollution in the form of sinle use plastic bottles. The whole thing seems a bit stewpid to me.

Bob

 

[les24preludes]

<< Food waste. I am from the generation whose parents went through WW2 and endured food shortages, the idea that good food was thrown away postwar was just unacceptable and recipes were adapted to make use of food that had not been eaten on the previous day.>>

I just could not agree more. It was a sin to leave food on the plate. I remember ration cards even.

We got by on bark, cardboard, raffia, anthracite and railway sleepers. We whittled twigs and played Cowboys and Indians in the woods with pieces of trees. For a big thrill we'd stand 6ft away from a railway line. By gosh it was a grand life. I saw my first banana at the age of 12.

 

[Vacumatic]

Always wondered why bottled is such a hit in North America with consumers. Most all municipal sources of water are tested and treated to meet certain safe for human consumption standards. Those on wells have to submit water samples for testing on a regular basis also. Quite a few municipal water treatment plants are now outsourced to large companies who also control the major share of bottled water produced in North America. Can you say Coke, Pepsi and Nestle? That is to say nothing of the massive amounts bottled water contributes to plastic pollution in the form of sinle use plastic bottles. The whole thing seems a bit stewpid to me.

Bob

I know a local business who supplies 6000 offices with drinking water in those giant plastic bottles, I asked the owner where he finds the water, they have a licence to pump the water from a farmers stream, they take a tanker and fill it every day. The water is perfectly clear and natural with no chemicals, tastes beautiful.

 

[R181]

I know a local business who supplies 6000 offices with drinking water in those giant plastic bottles, I asked the owner where he finds the water, they have a licence to pump the water from a farmers stream, they take a tanker and fill it every day. The water is perfectly clear and natural with no chemicals, tastes beautiful.

So the 6000 offices have no plumbing and they need the bottled water or they have plumbing but the supplied municipal water is not potable water? If they are hooked up to municipal water that is potable what is the need for this bottled water? Can't understand why people do this.

Bob

 

[MntnMan62]

So the 6000 offices have no plumbing and they need the bottled water or they have plumbing but the supplied municipal water is not potable water? If they are hooked up to municipal water that is potable what is the need for this bottled water? Can't understand why people do this.

Bob

I agree. Although there are varying levels of quality among municipal water supplies. Our drinking water is supplied by New Jersey American Water Company. They produce periodic test results showing that they comply with State and/or Federal drinking water standards. That said, our State mandated standards allow for a certain amount of less than desirable substances in the water. We have a filter in our refrigerator although I don't know how truly effective it is in eliminating those substances. I'm sure they reduce somewhat those levels. But we use our municipal water supply for our water needs. We also have a couple cases of bottled drinking water on hand for emergencies and for taking on the road. Although that is wasteful because we have plenty of insulated containers to put the water in. I know I use muncipal water for the water I take on my bike rides. If I'm doing more than 20 miles I'll fill a third and stash it somewhere outside the house so I can just stop quickly and grab it to conitnue on my ride. For the most part municipal water is good, and some is excellent. I'm sure people in Detroit and Flint Michigan may have a problem with that, and they rightfully do. You're correct. There is far too much wasteful human activity in this country. And even those of us who are mindful of it, still will practice wasteful behaviors until it is pointed out to us, as this thread has done. I used to think twice about grabbing one of those bottled waters in the basement. Now I'll think three and four times before I do.

 

[Deleted member 476]

Here’s a startling statistic: the average Canadian household spends CAN$1,766 (about £1,000) on food that is wasted every year.
(source: a 2019 study by Second Harvest and Value Change Management International)

You misinterpreted the data, as I did too when I first heard of the study last year. According to the report you source, the annual cost of avoidable food loss and waste in Canada is $1,766 per household, NOT what the average Canadian household spends. According to the research, the household spending portion represents around 21%. The rest is waste during production, manufacturing, processing and distribution. Further, some of the food loss is unavoidable, such as when inedible food by-products, like animal bones, are discarded.

That said, the study appears well researched and the main takeaway was that up to a third of the food waste generated could be avoided thru better food production management and go a long way towards both feeding the world and mitigating the environmental consequence of food waste.

 

[Deleted member 476]

For the world to make a shift to a vegetarian based diet...

Not happening! Humans are definitely omnivores. The best evidence is our teeth.