B&R adjustable razor available now at Bullgoose

[p.b]

A Timeless with a stand weighs in at $240, and that's not adjustable so fewer parts etc. Plus it's sold direct from the manufacturer, not via a vendor so there's no vendor mark-up in the Timeless price. I would assume they are both CNC machined so the lower cost of labour in Turkey would have minimal impact to the overall price. Add in shipping from Turkey to the US and import duties if there are any and I suspect B&R are making far less out of this razor than Timeless are out of theirs.

While it's very disappointing that the price is so high I don't think the hostility to B&R is warranted.

 

[Wayne]

I don't see any hostility to B&R. What I see is criticism fueled by disappointment over a price that for many is just a buck too far. Many including myself earmarked this razor and looked forward to it's release. Then to see the RRP so high left some of us deflated. It is in Wolfman territory at £300. Let's be honest the UK pound to U.S dollar usually works out the same regardless of any adjustment in currency differences. When you add to that the postage and rip off charges levied by the UK government it is a hefty price. Regardless we are where we are price wise. B&R have come out saying it is what it is. Will it sell? Yeah of course it will. It is coming to a SOTD near you very soon.
The razor community has members with deep pockets and collecting appetites. B&R will not lose out.

 

[theunnamed]

Surely you can dictate the retail price - it is YOUR product? Especially if it doesn't sell?
It sounds like your retailer has shafted you!

Hasan..... With due respect, you design and manufacture a razor, you send it out for evaluation, you bring it to market and now you're telling us you don't set the price?

I can't help but wonder just how many buyers you've lost by overpricing. I have no doubt it a fine razor but $300 is ridiculously high. Oh.... as you mentioned .. you don't set the price!.

You rightly state we have a choice. However, If you value your brand reputation you should take notice of the comments within this forum and value our feedback even if it's not to your liking.

First of all, if i didn't value your feedbacks I wouldn't be in this thread, just would have stalked.

What i mean about setting the price is that we actually don't know the costs of the Vendor, for example I thought EU VAT %19, but i learned that it is %22 in Italy at least if someone in Italy wants to get from Turkey. There is also %35 customs duty of the declared value, I don't know how much you pay the income tax etc. etc.

We set our bulk sale price, thats all.

To be honest I don't want to lose any buyers but there are certain restrictions, limitations which we cannot overcome.

Could you explain to me how you end up finding $300 as ridiculously high ? What are your criteria ? Do you make any comparison between razors ?

 

[Holyzeus]

I don't see any hostility to B&R. What I see is criticism fueled by disappointment over a price that for many is just a buck too far. Many including myself earmarked this razor and looked forward to it's release. Then to see the RRP so high left some of us deflated. It is in Wolfman territory at £300. Let's be honest the UK pound to U.S dollar usually works out the same regardless of any adjustment in currency differences. When you add to that the postage and rip off charges levied by the UK government it is a hefty price. Regardless we are where we are price wise. B&R have come out saying it is what it is. Will it sell? Yeah of course it will. It is coming to a SOTD near you very soon.
The razor community has members with deep pockets and collecting appetites. B&R will not lose out.

A Wolfman is less than £200 delivered plus customs if you don't get under the radar

 

[Holyzeus]

First of all, if i didn't value your feedbacks I wouldn't be in this thread, just would have stalked.

What i mean about setting the price is that we actually don't know the costs of the Vendor, for example I thought EU VAT %19, but i learned that it is %22 in Italy at least if someone in Italy wants to get from Turkey. There is also %35 customs duty of the declared value, I don't know how much you pay the income tax etc. etc.

We set our bulk sale price, thats all.

To be honest I don't want to lose any buyers but there are certain restrictions, limitations which we cannot overcome.

Could you explain to me how you end up finding $300 as ridiculously high ? What are you criteria ? Do you make any comparison between razors ?

$300 plus everything else is high to us in the UK

 

[p.b]

A Wolfman is less than £200 delivered plus customs if you don't get under the radar

Yes the B&R is 20% more than the Wolfman (£237) but there's no vendor mark-up in the Wolfman price. I have no idea what Bullgoose's mark-up is but I'd be surprised if it's less than 20%.

 

[Nishy]

I think several issues exist here. Firstly if no one liked the razor the passion that is being exhibited would not be apparent. Secondly as no one except the producers are privy to exact manufacturing costs we can only guesstimate as to what we believe pricing should be.

Without sounding facetious and all IMO it isn't a new novel concept, the USP IMO being stainless steel. In my experience the 8 levels of aggression didn't suit me. Other may have a different opinion.

Fair play to the manufacturer in letting us trial the razor without dressing it up and earlier, stating it as it is (some may have found this approach to be blunt YMMV). Again this is their perogative. As a consumer we are not bound to buying. The fact that the vast majority (on this thread) consider the razor to be priced too highly is evident. But no point raising blood pressure over.

Again IMO and without being circular. In order to provide a comparison, the new Blackbird OC comes in at half this price, polished (no stand). Stainless and a proven entity amongst many. The B&R is also more expensive than the new SE offerings in the Asylum RX and you can buy both SE base plates, top cap and handle from ATT for less.

 

[Wayne]

I agree with Nishy in that it's the fact that a lot of us wanted one that sticks in the throat.

 

[Len]

All this whining and moaning over price... like children in a toy store crying to mother because she can't afford the newest high end gaming console.

Generally, mature adults see and like something that they can't afford, pass it by, and wish the maker and those who can afford it well. I don't stomp my foot and raise a poop-storm because I can't afford a $200,000 car, or $100,000 watch... but to see grown men throw a tantrum over a $300 dollar razor... well, it frankly reeks of a spoiled sense of entitlement and immaturity.

************

For some justification of price (there needn't be any, because in a free society, buyers and sellers willingly choose what price they will buy or sell for, from this guy or the next. Don't like it? Too expensive? Try a cheaper model, in cheaper materials, or pick another vendor...), let us examine other razor makers...

Timeless Razor Master Kit: $465

Includes 2 heads, 1 base plate, 1 handle, 1 stand
Made in a lesser quality Stainless Steel (304), than the B&R (316)

OneBlade: $399 (V1 formally $299)

Includes 1 piece, pivoting head razor, stand, and stitched leather box
Made in 316L stainless steel (although, OneBlade does claim to make their current head in a higher, medical grade stainless steel)

Wolfman (Including head, handle, and stand) $340-$445 (depending upon stand and handle type) Price is more than doubled if Titanium or Copper is chosen

Includes head, handle, and stand
Made in 316L Stainless Steel

B&R Adjustable $300

Includes complex adjustable mechanism head, handle, and stand
Made in 316 Stainless Steel

***************

Sorry, but is B&R really off here on their price, considering the quality of metal used, and the complexity of the adjustable component? Wolfman and Timeless are not near as complex or hard to make (it is close to the complexity of a OneBlade), and Timeless is made in a lesser quality stainless steel!

People have been clamoring for an adjustable in stainless for ages now. Now that they have one, they moan about the price... but put up with, and praise, similarly priced razors that do less!

Look, if this is past your price point, but want an adjustable... go vintage, or buy one made out of pot metal... but Jesus, stop whining about the price and costs of the first ever made stainless adjustable!

 

[sɐǝɹpu∀]

Here are my calculations of the total price in the UK when bought from Bullgoose.
Duty is not payable if it is below £7. You might be lucky...

Razor $299.97
Shipping $25.38
Total $325.35

In GBP: £257.94
Duty @ 2.7%: £6.96 if lucky, £7 if not

Total before VAT if lucky : £257.94
Total before VAT if not: £264.94
VAT if lucky: £51.59
VAT if not: £52.99
Royal Mail penalty £8
Total cost if lucky: £317.53
Total cost if not: £325.93

 

[Len]

Here are my calculations of the total price in the UK when bought from Bullgoose.
Duty is not payable if it is below £7. You might be lucky...

Razor $299.97
Shipping $25.38
Total $325.35

In GBP: £257.94
Duty @ 2.7%: GBP 6.96 if lucky, £7 if not

Total before VAT if lucky : £257.94
Total before VAT if not: £264.94
VAT if lucky: £51.59
VAT if not: £52.99
Royal Mail penalty £8
Total cost if lucky: £317.53
Total cost if not: £325.93

Yeah, all those extra costs suck, but that is a political/governmental problem, mainly. Short of political action taken, I would suggest @theunnamed and other product makers work on making their items available to local vendors...

 

[theunnamed]

@Len Thank you for the great explanation. As a vendor i didn't want to tell names or manufacturers.

Maybe you are all right in calculating the costs and expenses. But you are at the wrong place to ask. All you need to do is asking the vendors in Europe (Your Shaving, Shave Lounge, Connaught Shaving, Executive Shaving, Gifts & Care and all the others) you use whether they are willing to carry our product, because some of them even havent answered our mails we just let them know we are here.

Go ahead and ask them, we can deliver B&R to you locally

 

[Wayne]

Always nice to have the alternative viewpoint in any argument Len.

 

[clint64]

All this whining and moaning over price... like children in a toy store crying to mother because she can't afford the newest high end gaming console.

Generally, mature adults see and like something that they can't afford, pass it by, and wish the maker and those who can afford it well. I don't stomp my foot and raise a poop-storm because I can't afford a $200,000 car, or $100,000 watch... but to see grown men throw a tantrum over a $300 dollar razor... well, it frankly reeks of a spoiled sense of entitlement and immaturity.

************

For some justification of price (there needn't be any, because in a free society, buyers and sellers willingly choose what price they will buy or sell for, from this guy or the next. Don't like it? Too expensive? Try a cheaper model, in cheaper materials, or pick another vendor...), let us examine other razor makers...

Timeless Razor Master Kit: $465

Includes 2 heads, 1 base plate, 1 handle, 1 stand
Made in a lesser quality Stainless Steel (304), than the B&R (316)

OneBlade: $399 (V1 formally $299)

Includes 1 piece, pivoting head razor, stand, and stitched leather box
Made in 316L stainless steel (although, OneBlade does claim to make their current head in a higher, medical grade stainless steel)

Wolfman (Including head, handle, and stand) $340-$445 (depending upon stand and handle type) Price is more than doubled if Titanium or Copper is chosen

Includes head, handle, and stand
Made in 316L Stainless Steel

B&R Adjustable $300

Includes complex adjustable mechanism head, handle, and stand
Made in 316 Stainless Steel

***************

Sorry, but is B&R really off here on their price, considering the quality of metal used, and the complexity of the adjustable component? Wolfman and Timeless are not near as complex or hard to make (it is close to the complexity of a OneBlade), and Timeless is made in a lesser quality stainless steel!

People have been clamoring for an adjustable in stainless for ages now. Now that they have one, they moan about the price... but put up with, and praise, similarly priced razors that do less!

Look, if this is past your price point, but want an adjustable... go vintage, or buy one made out of pot metal... but Jesus, stop whining about the price and costs of the first ever made stainless adjustable!

One correction should be noted. The prices listed on the Wolfman web page are CAD and will need to be converted to USD making the range $258-336 in order to keep the comparison fair. This does not change the overall point of your post.

 

[Cat_man_do]

A fatboy cost about 16 bucks in the day. No one's dribbling, justification is all. Sell a thousand? Or a million.
CNC is programmed to play, the steel is cents/pence per item.
Recovery of R&D is the variable to recoup, plus profit.
A decade ago raw steel was @£300/tonne, today it is cheaper to hire a skip.
Not cussing, just engaging...

...When I pay my cheapo mortgage off, I too will buy expensive cars. I cannot drive for the life of me, though! I fancy another Ducati...

Who said 'pile 'em high, sell 'em cheap!'?